Defying Limits and Inspiring Change with Bonner Paddock Rinn

Welcome to the Athletics of Business, a podcast about how the traits and behaviors of elite athletes and remarkable business leaders frequently intersect. The real stories and hard lessons to help you level up your leadership and performance.

Now your host, Ed Molitor.

Welcome back to another episode of the Athletics of Business podcast.

I am your host and CEO of the Molitor group, Ed Molitor.

And today welcome back our incredible.

Friend from episodes 90 and 91, Bonner Padock. And if you have not listened to.

Episode 90 or 91 yet, I highly encourage you. As a matter of fact, I recommend it to go back and listen to those episodes even before you jump into this episode, because there is so much.

In those two that add context to.

The stories that are told here today. If you did listen to those episodes, awesome. Let me remind you, or reintroduce you to Bonner Paddock. If you have not listened to those episodes yet, which I am convinced that.

You will, let me introduce you to Bonner. To say Bonner is amazing, to say.

He'S got an incredible personality, to say he's overcome so much and given so much would be a massive understatement.

Now, in 2018, Bonner summited Mount Kilmajaro.

World'S tallest freestanding mountain.

Just four years later, he earned the.

Elite triathlete title, Kona Iron man. Now, you might be saying, well, gosh, I'm sure someone may have done that somewhere along the way.

Well, thousands have done, each individually, right?

Thousands upon thousands.

But Bonner is the first person with cerebral palsy to do both.

See, when he was born, his umbilical cord had coiled twice around his neck, which deprived him of the oxygen he needed, and it caused parts of his.

Brain to die, as Bonner likes to say.

That cord didn't take his life, though.

But it did change it forever.

He was diagnosed in his youth, and he swore that he wouldn't let this neurological disorder limit him.

And for 29 years now, get this.

For 29 years, he guarded the truth about his health. He talks a lot about that in episode 1991. The sudden death of a friend's young.

Son, Jakey, who also suffered from CP.

Forced Bonner to reevaluate his life. And no longer would he be content striving for normal.

Think about the significance of that statement.

No longer would he be content striving for normal.

Instead, he would live life to its.

Fullest, pursuing one breathtaking experience at a time while raising money for special needs children along the way, and never turned.

Down a challenge for fear of his physical limitations.

He continues to do this amazing work.

That he started all the way back then.

And we'll talk inside of this episode about that work, about the impact he has, how many centers there are open globally and what's coming down the road for them.

And coming up soon, Bonner and his crew, some new members, all right, are.

Celebrating the 15th anniversary of his first climb. By what?

By going and climbing Mount Killy again.

Also something that I find really exciting. Bonner is able to recapture the rights.

To his story, his personal story, from.

The original publisher of his book, one more step, overcoming our challenges and conquering the impossible. New York Times bestseller. Now the book has been republished, released with new content. The link is in the show notes. Please do yourself a favor.

Read it, gift it, share it with your team.

It puts life in such crystal clear perspective for everybody who touches that book and reads it. Also in this episode, we are going.

To talk about accountability for the role.

We play in our journey, despite our circumstances, despite our challenges. And you can imagine how rich that is in the conversation.

And we talk about asking ourselves, what.

Are our intentions and where is the fear? And we talk about the fear of the unknown. And for many of us, for so many of us, the fear of unknown is what actually cripples us, paralyzes us, keeps us from taking that next step. But again, please go back, listen to episode 90 91. Embrace this episode. It's amazing what just a few years difference makes in Bonner's life and our lives here at the Molotor group. And I would love the continued feedback. I appreciate all the emails to me at Ed, at the Molotor group telling us what a difference the podcast has made. Hey, can I connect with the guests?

Whatever it is, keep sending it.

And if you want to find out more about the work that we do.

Here at the Molotor group, our 90.

Day leadership coaching program, our 90 day.

Emerging leader coaching program, all of the.

Other things that we offer. Just check out our website@themalitorgroup.com, that's themalatorgroup.com.

Now let's get to the important stuff. And that's Bonner paddock. Bonner, thank you so much for joining.

Us again on the Athletics of business podcast.

It is hard to believe that it has been, obviously, we've talked many times.

Since then, but it's hard to believe.

That we have recorded a podcast together. It has been almost three years. Wow.

That's crazy.

I can't believe that time has gone by that fast.

You've been up to a few things, by the way, in the last three.

Years, we're going to get into that. But to start this conversation, I'm going to say one word, okay? And that's it. I'm going to get out of your way.

And I want you just to tell me the first thing that comes to.

Your mind, to your heart, what that word means to you and how it's impacted your life. All right, sounds good.

I'm ready.

You ready? Okay.

Yes, sir.

The one word I want to say to you is Jake.

So the first thing comes to me is connection. He created the opportunity to really connect with the first person to accept me.

I felt fully with my CP, with.

Who I am, just as a person at that time was Jake's dad, who I met officially.

And so the second word is acceptance.

And understanding and beginning to learn what that feeling of acceptance is, which then led to inspiration. To have connection and acceptance, I think, equals inspiration to me, is what just came forward. And when you have inspiration, you have purpose. And when you have purpose, I think.

The journey becomes much more deep, profound, and directed. And.

So, just so you know, as you're sitting there listening, this was not scripted, like, literally. Bonner and I did not talk about this before. I didn't say, hey, Bonner, here's what I'm going to ask you.

Figure it out.

That's amazing. And Bonner joined us, as I mentioned, years ago on episode 90 and 91 of the Athletics of Business podcast. And we talked quite a bit about Jake and his father and the story and the journey. But can you just. For the new listener, the newer listeners who may not have listened to those episodes briefly describe where that came from and how Jake showed up in your life and continues to stay in your.

Life with what you do.

Perfect.

Yeah. When I was working for the Anaheim ducks in the middle of the lockout.

Of five, six, I got hired by them.

And during the lockout, the Samuelles said that they weren't going to lay anybody off. They suggested during the free time that.

We had was to join a charity.

And that was the first job that.

I had told beyond my application and.

That they knew Bob Wagner, who hired.

Me, knew I had cerebral palsy.

So that was the first time that.

I was open about my disability to that level.

So I was inspired to join a charity locally in Orange county when they said that, because I felt like they.

Were starting to support or I felt.

Freer to be more myself.

So I joined a local charity there.

That focused on disabilities like cerebral palsy. And I met Jake's dad there. He was on the board of directors, and I ended up sharing my story.

In front of the board, which then.

They invited me onto the board. But Jake's dad, Steve, sent me an email that night after I openly shared to a group for the first time about my journey and the power of his email, saying, when he said, hey, I went home and talked to my wife Allie about you, and you give.

Us hope for our son, Jake.

I cried at my desk, and I didn't really understand that till recently that.

The reason I cried was that I.

Felt Steve was the first person to fully accept me and love me for exactly who I am and not want anything.

And that's just how I felt.

So the power that I felt and the connection I felt with Steve was.

Like, after that email was instantaneous.

And when Jake suddenly passed away six months later, after Steve and I ran.

Together in the marathon, you know, I was so crushed.

And I realized now that I didn't.

Want him to feel the pain that.

I saw him feeling. So I wanted to do anything in my power to maybe help ease the family's pain.

And I realized that it was an.

Opportunity to do other things in the.

Name of Jake and his memory and.

Do that honestly for their family.

And that's really what originated my physical quests and world record attempts, was to.

Somehow, I think, subconsciously relieve that pain. If I could, in any way, for the first person and the first family.

That I felt, like, really loved and accepted me like their own, it was.

The only gift that I realized now.

I think I could give them and.

What an amazing gift it was.

And speaking of your world records, right? And speaking of climbing Mount Kili 15.

Years ago, we have the 15th anniversary.

What in the world are you going to do to celebrate that?

I don't know if you want the short version, medium version, or long version.

I mean, you could go out to dinner, bring everybody together.

You could do something.

So what is it? You give me your version. Don't worry if it's short or long.

You give me.

Okay, I'll take you back to May of last year. There's the team Jake water station at the Orange county marathon. Every year that we use to pay homage to Jake, and it's an exciting.

Fun thing to be part of.

So last year, Steve, Jake's dad, and some of his, Jakey's brothers, had come out to be part of that. And so we arranged for a tour.

At the brand new, huge center that.

We built in California that had opened.

A little bit before that.

And we gave them a whole personal tour of that. And so we go to lunch beforehand at one of their favorite taco shops because they don't live in southern California anymore. And so we're just sitting there casually.

It's this awesome little dive taco shop.

And we're sitting there with Dr. Minion and everybody else, and. And they always bring friends from Texas with them. And so the kids, or they're not kids now, they're adults, but some of their friends always ask me about Killy or Iron man or something else. So one of them asked about Killy and da da, and I was like, that's funny. Next year is going to being. This year is going to be the 15th anniversary that you just talked about. And I was like, it's crazy that it's been that long. And Steve, Jakey's dad, literally looks at me directly across the little tables and.

Literally goes, I'd do it.

And I kind of turned my head.

Sideways, and I was like, what the?

And I was like, seriously?

And he goes, I'd do it.

And then I looked at Tyler, his oldest son, right to his left, my.

Right, and he said, I said, would you do it? And he goes, oh, yeah, I'm in. And I said, well, I guess we're.

Doing Killy then, next year for the 15th anniversary. So for our celebration, I'd never thought I would do it again or anything like it.

And they would be the good reason to do it.

They would be the reason that it's worth it, because to share that experience with them. And we're going to use it as a celebration of what we all collectively.

Have accomplished in these 15 years since.

Now project possible was birthed to celebrate it. And they just want to go see all the centers and experience everything that I keep coming back and sharing with them the magic of East Africa and the people of Tanzania and Kenya and everything.

And it's just magical over there in.

Such a different way than what I grew up.

And so we're heading over there in July to climb Chili with 16.

There's going to be 17 of us total climbing, including myself. And so we're using the same master guides, which is going to be amazing. One of the master guides, you know.

They'Re still around, right?

Yeah. And one of them led us to one of our centers in Tanzania. So, of all things, years after he.

Was my guide, I got a message.

From him on Facebook saying if we could just give them advice on how he came across this one with his local church.

So went out there and saw.

It and we ended up building a new facility for what they were doing for some disabled kids in a very poor area of a small town, small city called Moshe.

And I think this is a great place to step into this. What's resulted from that first climb in Killy and again, episode 90 and 91, you amazingly just lay that out there. And I believe it was a day.

After the climb, a couple of days after when you got done with the.

Climb that you first went to see some different places.

And I might be, oh, 15 years ago. Yes.

Two days before.

I'm sorry. You can do much after. That's right.

Two days.

Two days before, I'm sorry.

Take us to the things that have.

Happened with the Jakey centers.

Right now we're talking from Mexico, which is going to be our 6th country.

That we are exploring, but we've kind of shifted gears where we still are.

Building team Jake centers per se.

When we find that it's the best thing to do in those communities, we.

Partner with local charities that are non government affiliated in each of the countries. And now what we're doing is we're developing a software that is going to.

Take our current centers, as well as.

Any existing local charities that are out there in the world and begin to link them together. Like we've seen the success of linking all of our current centers together and.

How they share, and they don't feel.

Like they're by themselves anymore. So the software actually is building a.

Little bit of a social network for the disabled community globally so that they.

Can share ideas, talk with each other.

Know that they're not alone.

Families can actually, or individuals can be.

Part of this software so they can say, oh, there's other mothers here in.

Tanzania or Kenya or whatever.

And so we're trying to create that.

You'Re not alone type of feeling, but it's also going to have training videos on the most common disabilities that we.

Are able to serve so that even.

If there's no center near these people, but there's a large organization, let's say, like save the children. Who does have a refugee camp or.

Something else that's providing food, water, shelter.

And basic medical care? They say the biggest underserved that they see in the refugee camps globally is.

Disabled people, because they need certain things.

And it's critical to them because they usually had to leave quickly.

They have left everything, if they had anything, if we can provide those videos.

To those staff and allow them to.

Connect within that community digitally, they can.

Actually watch their own videos and learn how to take care of their own.

Kids a little bit better than what they currently have. So it's this massive project that we're.

Building with one of our board members. Mike Sunwich is brilliant in this software scape, and he's the one that's designing.

And building it off of, literally a.

Software that you can buy off the shelf, per se, online.

And then he's making it custom to ours. So it'll take us about two years.

To beta test it and run it.

With some huge organizations and create it. But we believe it's going to be.

With their huge contacts in the 178 countries, that the top, I think, 15 charities in the world, size wise, are. They will push it out to their local charities is the idea that they partner with in each of their countries.

And we can reskin it, rename it.

All those things in their charity's name.

So it's something that's just, we're giving.

It out for free, and then we're building it so that it never can be not taken, but just that it can run on its own, not for in perpetuity, but that's the general concept of how we're creating it, that nobody really owns it.

It's truly fascinating and phenomenal when you start to think about the amount of lives that you can exponentially impact. Well, let's go back just so it's.

Clear what the team Jake centers, they do.

Like, when you first started the team Jake centers, what their mission was.

Okay, yeah, they're primarily great work.

They do, yeah, they are primarily focused on physical, occupational, and speech therapy, know, kids with disabilities.

Right now, we currently are focused on cerebral palsy, down syndrome, spina bifida, autism. And then we do see a lot of things that we don't really see here in the United States as well.

That's on top of. So. So it's like, you start to see.

The larger heads and things like that.

You have soft bones.

A lot of these things that we.

Have eradicated, for the most part, to most in the United States that I'm aware of.

In those things, you see club feet, you see those types of things in these countries that we still work with.

Because they also do need physical therapy, too.

Six centers right now. Number seven is coming in Mexico, correct?

Yeah, we're still looking for the partner in Mexico that would be the right one to fit all that. If not, we will still link all the local charities across this huge country into our huge software program and with our whole training programs and everything that we're developing.

Incredible. And let's talk about that amazing facility that you have in Los Angeles.

It's almost 10,000 sqft. It's some of the most cutting edge equipment.

And it's interesting because it's a concept that we've always thought would work really well. Where it actually brings together able bodied.

Kids and the disabled community, and where.

We believe that actually will help.

Is empowerment and acceptance is you put.

The able bodied kids that are recovering from knee surgery or something, they were just in a car accident, and so they're just more temporarily needing to rehab.

Something with the disabled community.

We believe it creates an electric way.

Of understanding compassion and exposing the world.

For able bodied families to learn about disabled children and what their families are needing to do on a daily basis.

That may help define.

We all hear spina bifida and autism.

And down syndrome, but most, at least where I grew up, really don't have.

A lot of experience with direct interaction with families or people that do have these disabilities. And so the more we can bring.

Those together, we feel that actually.

Creates such a better awareness of what's.

Happening out there, which only could help in the long run, because most of.

The time it's people just don't know.

So they don't want to ask questions.

They don't want to say the wrong thing, they don't want to come across rude. Jakey's mom said the same thing. She loved it when just people would come up and ask at the dinner table when they were out at a.

Restaurant or something that they would want to learn more about Jakey, and he.

Loved it, and so did he. It's trying to invite that inclusion more versus exclusion based upon fear of saying the wrong thing, not knowing. That's mainly why we feel like it's excluded.

It's not maliciously trying to exclude people.

It's just they don't know how to.

Approach or interact at first.

And you don't know what you don't.

Know, but you start and you take this to where your other centers are.

Right.

Is that something that's even feasible to do there in terms of the inclusion? Because when you first started this, you were blown away.

Like, literally their own people thought that.

These children were possessed and there was something wrong with them because they had these disabilities.

Yeah.

The more we kind of explore in.

Different parts of the world and meet organizations and people that are from those.

Parts of different parts of this world.

We see that there seems to be.

A lot of shame around in some of these cultures.

And it's just because they don't even understand what their child has, their own child. And there's not a lot of information readily available in developing countries to really.

Support these parents when their child does have a disability. And so the unknown creates a gigantic hesitancy, which can easily lead to doing.

Very, very poor choices of how they treat their kids in very potentially inhumane ways or ways that are very damaging.

To not only the disabled child, it's.

Also very damaging to the community in.

General, because it's like a secret and they know it.

And when we all know we carry the weight of a secret, we all know what that all does to each of us individually, slowly eating away inside of us. So the outreach, like our northern Uganda.

Center, is the most exceptional community outreach.

We'Ve ever come across. The level of what they cover and how they're integrating within the communities. In the very rural parts, up by the South Sudan border, the DRC.

The Congo border, they border some very volatile countries and they're reaching very big.

Swaths of areas that really aren't that reachable and having tremendous impact as using these parents, primarily the mothers of disabled.

Kids, as the leaders within their communities.

Bringing multiple villages together to meet on.

A weekly basis to share what their.

Life is like and to have that support group. And it's a very empowering thing that.

We'Re seeing that everybody's feeling more comfortable.

To talk about it and embrace those.

Children and not again.

The same thing we have in the.

United States was know.

Jakey's mom would say that most people would just kind of stare or side eye or something like that, but would never say anything.

So the veil looks different in the.

United States, but it's very similar that it's more standoffish and not willing to step forward and ask about it. It just looks in different forms over.

There that are more real or in.

Your face and startling than the subtleness that happens in my experience in the.

US 15 years later.

17 of you, including the original guys.

Including, am I correct, fireman Robinson on this one?

He was until the doctor. He's getting knee surgery this month. Yeah. So unfortunately, he had to back out after.

He would take a lot to make that man back out of anything.

Correct. And he's learning that, which is a good thing, I think that's a good trait I love.

I got to give him a holler then. Yeah, I'm sure he feels awful. Feels awful.

Three original climbers of the group and.

Then Jakey's dad and three of Jakey's brothers. Neil Bascomb, the co author of one more step is doing it as well. And then a bunch of other people that have been involved with the organization, David Aberton, another board member, is climbing. So yeah, it's fantastic.

I'd love to have David on the podcast.

Just so much to talk about. Hey, speaking of your story.

Right. Speaking of the book, it would be phenomenal if you could get the rights.

To your book and you could add some stuff to it that you've done.

Over the last 15 years and some.

New stories, some new twist and how things turned out in certain relationships in your life.

What does that look like to you?

After a couple of years of working.

With Harper Collins and a special thanks.

To Lisa Sharkey, were able to.

Get the rights back of the book. And so it is now property of the foundation of Project possible. And we are going to be releasing a revised version here. Today is, we're in mid April now, so any week now we will have, everything's been edited. Everything is now we're just uploading it and getting the files over to Amazon and all the others. So it should be coming out any week now.

I can't wait. And when you say revised, what will be some of the things that you have added that you subtracted?

How is it going to look?

Yeah, so subtle changes to the COVID We get to permanently add that nice little red Dot on the front of it that says New York Times bestseller. So that was pretty cool. We had never done the audiobook, so the audiobook was recorded by myself, which is cool and quite a four day experience.

But the audiobook will be released. With that, we added a new chapter.

That was kind of like an intro to the intro of kind of sharing what's happened since the book was published in 2015. So there's an update on that. But primarily most of it we wanted.

To keep kind of as the same.

We didn't really change. So, like when you hear mentions of the foundation, they'll still say Om foundation in there. Although the new chapter that we added.

The intro, I guess, does say project.

Possible and updates those types of things. So we wanted to kind of keep the integrity of the book as is. Nothing really had changed. We didn't notice anything, glaring mistakes or anything that may have been misquoted or at least wasn't brought forward to us.

So we decided that if people love.

The book based as what it is, why mess with that and only just add a little bit to it to enhance it.

We added the QR code. We readjusted some of the pictures, QR.

Code kind of just easily gets. We're going to add more digital files.

So that they can see more color.

Photos and everything like that.

So we just tried to go forward with technology and then the audiobook, and.

Then secondarily, the next phase, once this eventually rolls out, is we will get it translated into Spanish and Swahili, because.

That'S where all of our centers are.

The primary languages are spanish and Swahili so far.

And we are going to give it.

Away free in our centers, in those languages, and begin to try to offer.

It up to anybody that basically would.

Like to understand more of the history of why we're there, why we're supporting them, and how we honestly got to that point. So that will be given away free in those countries.

That's unbelievable.

You have to be thrilled about that. I mean, to think about that you're just absolutely, literally just giving it.

Away that people are going to be.

Able to connect with. They already know what you're doing is amazing, but when they know the why.

Behind it and they know the story behind it, I think it makes it.

That much more powerful.

Yeah, I agree.

And now we have control of that. We have control of the documentary, which the amazing filmmakers gifted that to the foundation as well.

So the overall parts of everything that.

We'Ve developed are all part of the foundation now and under one roof, which gives me amazing gratitude and happiness, knowing that whatever we do and forever long.

We'Re able to keep doing this, the.

Foundation will kind of have all these key assets to continue whatever its goals are.

So I've got to ask you, I have to ask you a serious question.

Because this is going to be for the people out there trying to push themselves and trying to think differently and reframe some situations.

All right, first person was CP to.

Climb Killy, unassisted to complete Kona.

All right, we talked about on the.

Previous two podcasts, the mental scars and how long they take to heal.

Right?

We talked about the physical.

What does someone like you, who has.

Been through so much, who has grown so much physically, mentally, emotionally, what in.

The world do you do to challenge.

Yourself now and to get yourself outside.

Your comfort zone daily to continue to grow?

Because it would be real easy for.

Someone like Bonner to kind of rest.

On her laurels and say, man, I've really done a lot. I'm doing some really cool work, and I've got this amazing board and this amazing project possible. We're doing some cool stuff.

I'm good.

But every time I talk to you.

There is something new can you share with us, just since our last time.

Recording a podcast, the things that you.

Have done to grow and evolve and.

To get better right now for that.

Part, the first thing that comes forward for me is just my personal journey and exploring areas within my own journey.

Of expanding my understanding, trying to open.

My mind and things to see how and what this whole greater thing is.

That I get to experience every day.

And it's beyond my total realm. I don't think I'll ever fully understand it. But for me, I just am enjoying living in a place here in Mexico that is very fertile with growing a lot of the food of Mexico and.

Learning how to grow food and trying.

To connect interesting ways that I was. I grew up in Orange County, California.

So I grew up with food very.

Plentiful, very available, all types, always looking kind of pretty.

And it just gave a different story.

Than my understanding of I didn't really appreciate the food that I ate and that nourished me. And so part of what I'm trying.

To learn now from square one is trying to understand how all of this thing works.

Like watching food grow is fascinating. And volunteering at this local little organic farm has been amazing to understand, begin to understand a very complex, yet very.

Simple thing of how food starts from.

A seed, grows into something that we can enjoy, and then that also can return back to the seed and grow again.

And so it's just been a fascinating thing to understand how I am, be.

More connected, how everything works. And so I know it's a very broad thing, but primarily personally, it's like girlfriend is in love with this amazing woman.

And we have a great way of.

Connecting that I've never experienced and continuing to explore that with someone where I've done a lot of this road by.

Myself, per se, and to have someone that's special in my life, to begin.

To really explore a very serious connection.

That is special and beautiful in its.

Own right, while also honoring the challenges that it brings. Those are the hardest things for me, who is used to making those decisions just by myself and everything else.

So that is a whole new world that pushes me outside the box of just my choice to do it.

Then I can take full accountability.

Adding somebody to that completely changes the.

Dynamic in a very beautifully challenging way.

To how that works with two people.

Moving within the same space and how.

That can be a new way of.

Just even enhancing all of this experience.

At what point in that relationship, right.

Did you realize, because you really had an interesting journey, because even though you may have had many great relationships around you and many people in your life. There were times you felt all alone.

With what you have because you truly couldn't fully disclose what was really going through your mind and heart. And now here you are, connected to this wonderful person, and you realize there.

Are some things you have to give.

Up 100% or how is.

I should say how well, I'll say.

It'S going well in the sense that some of the words that are very easy to maybe begin to kind of describe it is grace. One of them is grace. And allowing the natural, just like I.

Talked about the food and watching it.

Grow organically and naturally, everything is a microcosm of these foods that I've been just beginning to learn how to see because they got bugs eat through some of the arugula. And the tomatoes all have different shapes.

But they're all beautiful, and they're all.

Nutrient, and they all taste great, but they all look very different.

And so I had to get outside.

Of this conceptual box of everything needs.

To look a certain way, including a.

Relationship with another person.

And so to step out of this box and to allow grace within that and to allow myself to know I'm.

Going to make mistakes and not hold.

Myself so strictly over those, but use.

Them as learnings and not failures as.

In a bad thing.

It's almost reframing a lot of words that I had in my vocabulary.

There's being lonely, and then there's being alone.

And I would say that I grew up and I was very lonely when.

I grew up and felt like this big secret of didn't know what Bonner.

Had for many years, then was properly.

Diagnosed with cerebral palsy. Later growing up and then still not.

Talking about it is the best way to say it. I don't feel like they kept a.

Secret, but it's a form of keeping.

A secret when you just don't talk about it versus actually telling me not to talk about it.

They didn't do that, but we just didn't talk about it.

So you knew that there was this heaviness of something that we're just not talking about.

And so when I learned growing up.

That we just don't talk about things that are too complicated, too heavy, too emotional, too this or that.

And so to then come into a.

Relationship with somebody intimately and have this connection and learning that you can't hold on to things like that, you need to share them, but learn how to.

Share them in a loving manner and.

Invite each other into spaces that we.

Can have very beautiful conversations albeit can.

Be very tough at times. And know that there is still this overarching love above us is very hard because it takes on your biggest insecurities. It's easy for me and had because this is not the first time that we have dated. So we have learned a lot and have gone around the racetrack, as I.

Say, sometimes multiple times.

We keep inviting each other forward and holding each other now to doing our own work. And it's so important for me to.

Be with somebody that's willing to have.

That humility and humbleness, to know that they are working through their traumas and their conditionings, and so am I. And to support each other on those.

Versus in the past, I would get.

Afraid of those and want to criticize or withdraw for safety because that's what.

I did as a kid was withdrawal.

And putting up the wall was what.

I did for safety, perceived safety.

It's interesting, and I think in terms of the leadership and the coaching leaders that we work with here at the monitor group.

But you said something.

So, I mean, this is all very significant. It all ties together to what I'm about to say. There's a difference between being lonely and being alone. And the irony of all of this.

Is when you were lonely, you were around a lot of people. A lot, tons. And now you're not alone, but it's.

A little bit quieter for you down in Mexico, and you're as comfortable as you've ever been and probably have as.

Many amazing people in your life as you've ever had.

Yeah, it's the old adage of quantity versus quality. For me, I had the quantity life for a long time, quantity of people around me, quantity of money, quantity of things, and all of these external things that I was using to define me.

Which really wasn't my true self.

I still felt like, in my own way, by my own design, subconscious or.

Consciously, and a mix of both, I.

Was creating a false narrative, I was.

Creating a false story because that's what.

I thought people wanted and that's what I thought I needed to do to.

Get to this more connection and more happy. Let's call it happy for simplicity, more.

Happiness and everything else. And learning that all of those things actually, if they're not done with intentionality, and if I truly wanted them or needed them, then they're defining a part of me that really isn't me. It's maybe part of the shadow side.

Which is things that I had to suppress.

It's Carl Jung. The shadow side is all the things that we had to disown or suppress as a kid. And we do very interesting ways to try to appease those shadows when we know that they're not, when they're the ones in charge, not our true self. And so those fed a lot of.

That stuff, and I had to learn how to work with them and say, what is my true self, and what.

Do I really want and need in my life? And it brought it to much more.

Of a simplistic, yet beautifully close circle of people that is much smaller, yet extremely tight. And the trust and safety within those people that I have is something I.

Never felt growing up. And so that was the biggest switch for me.

And one of the lessons that I learned, like all of us in life, the hard way, is we truly do.

Have the ability to be the author.

Of our own story.

What advice would you give someone who's in a really good place in their life, let's say, professionally right now, what they're feeling, the things that you just talked about? Because what I have found with clients, when they struggle with certain things or self identity, self limiting beliefs, self limiting.

Behaviors, because of all those different things that we're talking about, they feel like.

They have to scrap the whole thing.

And start all over and move away.

From where they're at to even have a shot.

But the reality of it is, you don't.

One part of your life's in great shape. That doesn't mean they're not mutually exclusive. Like, you can fix this.

You are.

What advice would you give to that.

Person who might have those self limiting beliefs?

The self doubt, the imposter syndrome, or the pain?

What I had to learn through Nicaragua.

Experience when I retired, I will say.

I moved to Nicaragua, and it was under good intentions, per se, but literally, it was running from everything.

When I wanted to look at it.

There was goodness laced in there where I built a center and everything else for a team. Jake, center there.

But when I look at it, I.

Was mostly trying to run from myself. And that was a big chunk of what Nicaragua experience was, because it does put you out there in a remote place.

And so that loneliness, if you don't.

Understand how to be alone, then that.

Loneliness and everything follows with you.

So I had to come back from.

There and really begin to understand what my passion and purpose is.

And that can be in so many different forms. My passion and purpose was very well intentioned and going very well with the foundation. So one part of that was going well.

But then when I looked at my.

Personal life, I said, what is my passion?

And purpose in my personal life. And being honest, I had to say.

I actually do want to have a partner. And I do want to be in.

A space where my passion and purpose.

For that and connecting with someone on such a level that only an intimate.

Partnership can happen is going to be.

So much more challenging. Because that wasn't shown to me growing up. Parents got divorced at an early age, so I didn't really see a lot of healthy relationships growing up.

And so I had to go and look at what I was utilizing in.

Parts of my life that weren't really.

Who I was and realize that my truth is not the real truth of what's going on in the world.

So I had to understand that there's always two truths in the room. Like you and I have two truths. Right now, we're having the same experience.

Per se, meaning we're having a conversation. But your truth is different than my truth, and they're both equal.

I take that in every part of my life now that when I'm talking.

With someone or anything else, it takes the judgment away.

Our harshest judger and inner critic is on ourselves.

So if I actually hear stories, self doubts, impostor syndrome, all of those things.

When I hear that come forward in.

Me, I ask myself a question. Is this true? Is this really true?

Or is this my trauma? Is this my conditioning? Is this the imposter syndrome?

Is this the shadow?

And my work with Connor Beaton, he's.

The founder of man talks.

He is an expert in Carl Jung and was one of learned from one.

Of the disciples of Carl Jung in.

The godfathers of psychology world. And so he's taken it into the modern day and really helped me understand shadow, imposter syndrome. All of these things that were really running my life in the areas that I wasn't happy. And so once I was able to identify those, all of a sudden those areas started opening up differently.

And it's just trusting that the unknown is what stops most people, is the unknown.

And that's where the impostor comes in. That's where the doubts come in, because you don't know what's on the other side of fear. And so instead of me running from fear and everything else like I did.

To Nicaragua, I have learned to turn and face that fear, but not fear as an enemy.

Seeing it as an invitation to get to know that part of me better. And not shaming myself and not criticizing myself for being. Not recognizing it or making mistakes, which I try to reframe now, is learnings and using those learnings for wisdom so that I don't repeat those things anymore, instead of beating myself up and calling me stupid for making that mistake or.

This mistake and saying, great job on.

Putting yourself out there.

You move through fear into the unknown.

Didn't nail it, and that's okay. So what did we learn from that? So that we don't repeat that way. And then we have to be willing.

To move through the fear again in another direction, not knowing if that's going.

To be a better direction or what. The lesson may come out of it.

But have to be willing to pause.

And really assess, why am I doing this?

What's my intentions? Where's the fear in it?

That's probably the direction I need to move towards.

Or it's telling me you've done that direction.

Let's not go down that road again. Let's look at the other part of.

Fear, which is the unknown and go maybe that way.

It's interesting. You talk about move in the direction of your fear. We talk about it.

Run to the fight. Yes.

Just go confront it.

Deal with reality in real time in the fear of the unknown, unfortunately, and tell me if I'm off here.

Unfortunately, we are now living in, and we've created this mess of a society where the way we fill that void.

And the fear of the unknown is.

By surrounding ourselves with people that are going to tell us what we want.

To hear, they're going to fill it.

And that's why we have all this divisiveness. That's why we have all of this. If you don't agree with me, then you are complete horses rear end, and.

I can't stand you. And you see it.

You see it show up in their.

Professional lives, their personal lives.

When you're talking about move towards the.

Fear, you're talking about move towards the fear with the curiosity, the intent, the.

Willingness to be vulnerable and figure it.

Out to the best of your ability.

How much of a challenge was that.

For you when you first started doing that?

It was a massive challenge.

Huge, biggest challenge ever. Because the one way I kind of.

What I'm hearing from you is what I hear in that is the way.

That I used to do it and still do it time, because I understand that I still have that in me to go other directions that I'm like, I know better.

Not sure why I did that, but.

I did it and then try to back up again and go in a different direction. The number one thing I hear in that, though, like you said, is one.

Preys upon differences and divide, which is fear based.

And then the other way, like you.

Said, is, I think, is through love, but it's all within us.

And so turning inward is what I would say is the biggest thing that's changed for me versus blaming outwardly. I would point at other people, and I grew up learning that from my parents is like, I saw that you either don't talk about it or you blame somebody else. There was very little accountability happening within each individual.

So I wasn't modeled that to be in a healthy way with myself is.

We have to take accountability for our role in everything. And that has been a game changer.

For me, is seeing what my role.

Was in anything that happens in my life and anything that happens within my life.

I've played a role.

And so what choices did I make? What did I maybe miss? Those are the things that we don't. And then to come back and do these things that we don't see in politics a lot at all, if any, is apologize. There's scapegoating, there's gaslighting, there's all these terms and everything, but you're really seeing a lack of accountability. And the inability for people in a.

Healthy way to hold people accountable in.

A healthy manner is being lost. I think it's becoming a lost art of how you and I could have very difficult discussion while maintaining love and.

Respect for each other.

Having and knowing that we have differences of opinions because our truths are going to be different. There is no two people that have identical truths. And then somewhere in the middle, usually that's how you get with both people taking accountability. And where my relationship has gotten so.

Beautiful with Jill is that there's accountability on both sides.

There's a willingness to find that space in the middle.

That is where we can discuss and.

Really come to an agreement on things.

While knowing that I'm not right, she's not wrong.

Nobody's good, nobody's bad.

We just are living within our truths.

And when we do that, it brings.

Us together and we can actually have.

Beautiful conversations with each other.

And that's where you get, I think, a much healthier in business, in politics, in sports, in anywhere. When we're able to come together, you.

See it like heck. My San Diego's Aztecs. Let's talk about the know.

Let's talk about the Aztecs.

What a run.

But you mean besides their hand at the Creighton game? But we won't go. That was an amazing game. An amazing. Dutch is the best. I mean, I couldn't be happier I.

Just wish I would have got Yukon.

Yeah. The Fisher story is amazing. Mark Fisher, Steve's son and I believe that was the link that this team really could see. What's the bigger picture in this whole entire journey is not basketball games. It's this man and the way he's approaching his greatest challenge, which seems to be far greater than any challenge that we are aware of anybody else on that staff. So there was a unifier there that I would say that definitely added some boost to the positive energy and the.

Ability to understand that together and supporting.

Each other is going to be far greater time than those guys would probably get on top of each other and chirp at each other negatively.

And I saw that. I feel like just not being in the huddle, but I got that general.

Feel that's what cultivated from that team, that there wasn't the one person that was bigger than the team in that whole group.

And I think that's for me.

Knowing that I'm an important part. I'm not bigger or smaller than anything else. And my truth is equal to everybody's truth that I come across.

And you know what?

I'm going to take that a step.

Further because I really think that we.

Can all find a mark Fisher in our life if we just stop 100%. And I think that it would behoove all of us to do that. And I grew up 100%. I just grew up around the fact, realizing the significance and knowing the significance. I was taught this by my father.

And my mother of, somebody always has.

It tougher than yourself.

Right? And that isn't the old school. Like, don't feel sorry for self. Someone has it worse than you. Okay?

Even though that was a little bit of the south side, irish catholic way. But no, what they would instill in.

Me is the fact that learn from it, appreciate it, serve them, find power.

In their story, and surround yourself with people like that.

And that's going to take everything in.

Your world to a whole different level. And the other thing I have found, and this would just benefit our world.

In general, especially the way things are right now, is the more you rally.

Around something that is bigger than yourself, the more you have the difficult conversations, the more you have, what was it? The willingness to meet in that space in the middle.

Right.

Take the accountability. But that willingness to meet in the.

Space in the middle, when you do that at this level, okay.

And obviously the listener can't see me.

I got my hand about chin level.

Next thing you know, you're going to be able to take it to this level and then this level. Or if you want to go the.

Other way, you'll dig deeper and deeper and you'll be able to.

Handle greater things and take on his task together. And, I mean, you've seen that shown up your world, and that's something I want to make sure we touch on.

Before we wrap this up is in.

Your book, you talk about some of the challenging relationships to people very near.

And dear and very close to you, right?

Probably some that you thought would never heal or would never improve or would never get better. Can you talk to the. Because there's probably listening right now that's saying, man, that's great.

It's worked out for him.

It's never going to work out for.

Me because I can't see past this.

How over time have your relationships evolved.

And have you learned to reframe them.

To see them from a different vantage point?

Yeah, the reframing is key and learning a thing is called, I call it protecting my energy and protecting my energy.

I kind of know I put people.

In three different rings.

So think of like a target, like a bullseye.

There's the smaller one that's in the.

Middle, then the medium one that's next out, and then the next larger circle is that.

And it's constantly fluid. But I move people in and out. The inner one rarely moves as much, but there are people drifting in and amongst those three rings.

Based on that, I know how much.

Energy I am willing and want to.

Give to each of those relationships because.

I know I have limited amount of energy, meaning time. You can use the word anything you.

Want to put on there and it's a value and whatever the value is.

And I feel like my time or.

Energy is the most valuable that I have. So moving people amongst those three rings.

Has been very important to me. And family has been the most challenging for me. Primarily.

My mom, oldest brother and my dad for a bit were my three most.

Challenging relationships and still are to their own different beautiful ways. But seeing them as beautiful challenges versus.

What I used to look at them as, lot of anger, lot of pain.

I was projecting my pain in other ways.

Instead of learning how to go and meet my pain, release that pain. And through actually learning how to build.

New and different relationships with each of them, that protects my energy first and.

Foremost, which means I still have enough energy to give them.

I'm giving them what energy I want.

To, which keeps me still in love.

It doesn't wear me down to the.

Point where when I'm tired, fear and.

Anger can easily creep in if we have that unhealthy still stored in us. So my mom is probably the hardest, most challenging one. My oldest brother as well is still a challenging one.

And they have both been in all.

Three rings in my life. My dad is back into the smallest.

Closest ring and dealing with his on.

Stage either dementia and Alzheimer's that we're.

Starting to see it's moving fast has really put an interesting understanding of.

What I want from each person. And I ask myself that, what do I really want from them? Am I still trying to get something from them? Am I still trying to get the acknowledgment and love and things that I.

Didn't feel like I got as a kid? Or am I giving them my energy.

For what the current relationship is able to develop? What does that middle space look like for each of them?

With my mom, she's in the third ring still.

She's in that outer ring.

I still love her.

My time and energy with her is very limited. And for the most part, my visits.

With her and interactions with her are rewarding because I'm able to do that.

My oldest brother is now out in.

That outer ring where I hardly ever speak to him.

I did that to protect my energy.

Because I didn't feel like that energy. And so being willing to move past the labels that we put them on and society puts them on just because.

They'Re family does not mean we have.

To put up with any. And so if we feel that.

Relationship is not in a healthy space and we aren't able to find that.

Middle space together, then I have to.

Move them to that outer ring until both of us are able to find some type of space where we feel.

Safe and we feel like we can.

Actually develop and maybe increase the energy spent into that relationship. So it's very fascinating to have two of them more on the outer ring now and one of them on the.

Very inner circle as well.

I love it. An amazing man doing unbelievable things.

Bonner, I appreciate you so much. We've got a couple of things to cover here, though.

So the revised book, when it comes out, will they be able to go to the website project possible and find it?

Amazon?

Talk to me here where we can find the book.

Yeah, it'll be on all the major platforms, digital online platforms like Amazon and everything like that. It won't be in bookstores that we're aware of and then digitally, it'll be on iTunes, it'll be on all those things that you can digitally download the digital version and then the audiobook, it'll be on audible and all those as awesome.

And then projectpossible.org. If someone's interested in sponsoring and donating somehow finding a way to connect to the work that you do, is there a way on there that they can.

Get connected to you?

Yeah, they can donate on projectpossible.org. And still, 100% of all donations go to our projects and centers, so nobody takes any of the money or anything.

How about your social media?

Where can they find Bonner?

Yeah, project possible is on Instagram and Facebook, so you can find the foundation on there.

Okay, what about you? If they want to follow you on Killy in this journey, it will be.

Through both of those social media outlets. It'll all be posted through Project Possible's social media stuff and on our website.

Well, I wish you the best of luck with everything. Thanks, brother. I can't wait to follow this.

Climb on Killy. Let's wrap it up with this. I know the answer, but the listener.

Doesn't know the answer.

Okay, what's different this time?

What's different between this climb?

What's the difference between this climb and the climb?

15 years ago, I was talking to Jake's dad about that.

I don't feel like I have anything to prove this time. I actually don't even feel like I.

Have to get to the top.

For me, it's the experience of being together with these amazing people that have been such a huge part that this is a village that has taken to.

Bring myself individually on my journey as.

Well as project possible. It's been a lot of.

People taking on this task.

And so to celebrate it after 15 years and just talk about all the amazing things, then go visit our centers.

In Kenya and Tanzania and see how it's actually daily impacting.

Yeah, I'm going to need a lot of Kleenex. Steve already said that as well. But it's just going to be such a different approach.

And that was the thing.

I don't have to get to the top. I don't have to prove anything. I'm there for the connection and the experience with these amazing people and just seeing what comes of it and try to be much more present than I was last time.

It was just such a really challenging.

I did not enjoy that experience 15 years ago.

That's the fact. And I'd like to go give it.

Every opportunity to have a much different.

Experience 15 years later.

And the fact that you're taking this approach might be what makes it even.

More feasible for you to get to.

The top, because you might be more open and more aware to the fact, the power of what you guys are.

Doing as a group.

You might see that vision of Jake.

In your head, like, don't stop now.

You didn't just get here to stay here.

Come on.

But, no, I wish you all the best luck. It's going to be absolutely amazing. Thank you for your time. I appreciate it. And I look forward to the day that I'm sitting next to you there in Mexico, eating from that wonderful garden that you showed me the last time we talked.

Absolutely.

You're welcome anytime you want to defrost with that cold weather.

Yeah, you ain't lying.

All right, Bonner, thank you so much. Look forward to connecting again soon.

Thank you so much, man. Talk to you soon.

Thank you for listening to the athletics of business. Be sure to give us a rating and review so we know how we're doing. For more information about the show, visit theathleticsofbusiness.com. Now get out there. Think, act and execute.