Find a Way with Brian Barone

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A podcast about how the traits and behaviors of elite athletes and remarkable business leaders frequently intersect. The real stories and hard lessons to help you level up your leadership and performance. Now your host, Ed Molitor.

Welcome back to another episode of the Athletics of Business podcast. I am your host and CEO of the Molotor Group, Ed Molly. And today's special guest is someone who I consider to be family. Not like family, but absolute family. My great friend, someone I have so much respect and admiration for. I had the good fortune and the honor to coach down at Texas A and M University. Head men's basketball coach at Southern Illinois University, Edwardsville. Brian Barone. This is a fun conversation with a ton of value. We're going to talk about find a way and what that means to Brian and his SIUE basketball program. And it's things that he's learned along the way, the journey that he's on, his stops at the Division 1 level at Green Bay, Indiana, Marquette, Illinois State.

And we're going to talk about why locking into the beliefs that everything is better together and to never do it alone helped his basketball program grow through the adversity that they faced last year. And besides the COVID or because of the COVID they had 19 games. Now think about this, 19 games in 43 days. In the middle of the season they had a 33 day stretch with no games. And then after December 21st, they only had five practices where they had their complete team. Okay. And that's just a little bit about what we'll talk about. We'll talk about why it is so important for you to know your role, to embrace your role and to be a star in your role. Brian shares some stories about how his team members, how his players, how his staff, they absolutely protect the locker room.

And one of the things, one of the many things that Brian is so good at that I love about how he does things is he knows his players at such a grassroots level. He knows everything there is to know about their stories, where they come from, what's poured into their world, what's created, their circumstances and how they responded to it. And Brian's going to share with us how by leaning into those stories allows him to put them into the best position possible to be successful on and off the court. And there's so much more in this conversation. Brian, thank you so much for joining us on the Athletics of Business podcast. It is good to finally have you here.

Yeah, it's nice to finally be invited, you know, 130 previous people to get here But I'll tell you, I'll take the top 132.

Hey, as long as it makes you feel better. Because you know that's not true, right? You know it's not true. It's just been hard. Our schedules have conflicted. It's been hard.

Now we've been traveling a lot this last year. Everyone's been out.

It's been a packed zoom schedule. Hey, well, seriously though, thanks for joining. Man, it's been unbelievable. I mean, it's going to be your third season. You really haven't had anywhere near a semblance of a normal season. I mean, your first year is never normal. You know, regardless of COVID ended or not Covid ended. And then your second season, I can't wait to dive into that because, I mean, you can make a movie about a college basketball team during COVID and it could be about the SIU Edwardsville team and people still wouldn't believe it. Like, it's too tomba. Tell us a little bit about that season.

Yeah, I mean, like you said, the first year you kind of inherit a team and your world spinning and you get the job and then next thing you know, the season's over, you know. You know, and it's nine months into it and the world shuts down. Going into last season, you know, you have these aspirations and you're excited about, you know, okay, here are the adjustments I'm going to make. Here's the prep going into the season, from your off season workouts to your summer workouts, all that kind of stuff, but never totally understanding. It was, it was never happening. It seems like it was so long ago, but really about a year ago, like there was still kind of like this was just the time where were all thinking we might not have a season.

But the summer it was like, hey, it'll be back to normal sooner than later, was, you know, kind of the commoner approach. And I would put myself in that category. But then last year, you know, we, you know, the season started where were going to play at a Youngstown State tournament. One of the people in their, on their team or in their environment, you know, they got knocked out because of COVID protocols. So were going to play Youngstown State, Niagara and I believe a Division 3 team. And then that happened probably on a Wednesday and by Saturday or Sunday were playing St. Louis and LSU. So you have all this Youngstown State.

And it wasn't like those were guaranteed games at that point in time.

No, it wasn't like you were going to fund the program in any way? That was. Ray Gioletti and I had gotten to know each other. He's an assistant over at St. Louis. And Travis and I talked a few times and it was kind of like a pickup game. Like, hey, you guys got five, we got five. You want to come over here and play? And it was a tournament that was. Or, you know, a classic that was thrown together pretty quickly. And within a day and a half, were literally just pivoted. Fortunately for us, it was close, but. And then. Then the season just kind of went from there on out. There's a story after story from how it all went down well, and we're.

Going to get into that a little bit, but what we need to talk about is the fact that there are some expectations coming in the last season. You had done an unbelievable job of establishing the culture your first year. Right. And I want to jump into Findaway and what that means and the Fall fam. But you brought some players in. I mean, you brought some great players. Great. Not just talent, but great character and kids that you're looking forward to getting on the floor. Talk about how you were able to manage the whole, I guess a letdown in the fact that it was not going to be the season for those kids and for you and your staff that you thought it was going to be.

Yeah, I mean, it was no letdowns. It's the best way to say it probably just because you. We had high hopes, aspirations to really move this program to a spot that it hadn't been in Division 1. And, you know, through this whole recruiting process, you put together a team and a lot of it was based on relationships. You had to rely upon relationships because you couldn't sit down and talk to somebody or spark new relationships. Now we did on a few guys that kind of came along later, but ultimately you were doing the zooms, you were doing the phone calls, you were looking a lot of videotape and you're putting it all together. And even when you look at our conference schedule, we opened up at Morehead State with a win and then were out.

And they went on to win the.

Conference and they went on to win the conference. And went in there with. It was the only team, only time all year our entire team was. Was clear for the roster. It was one game that we had for, you know, Covid related issues or injuries or anything like that. So it was frustrating because at some point during the season, you couldn't sacrifice the culture. We had a good group of guys. But people reacted differently. And the relationships weren't necessarily all established from months of recruiting and sitting across the table and being in their home and saying, hey, here's what I'm going to do. It was, hey, you want to show up? And you did the zoom. And the first time you were meeting some of these guys was. Was literally your first team meeting when they got to campus.

And even then you were like, hey, are you in town? Okay, I'll see you in five days. Because you can't come around anybody for five days because you were just on an airplane. So it was just a constant state of chaos that you had to decide on how you were going to react to the unpredictable.

I think I saw a stat where you had five full team practices after. Was it December 21st?

Yep, yep. So I. That's on the high end. I mean, I don't even know if it was five.

That's insane. So how did you handle that situation?

Not very well. The. They, like, mentally it was tough because, I mean, come on, right? As the coach, you know, like, you. You want to go in there prepared, right? You want to put. You know, I don't think people totally understand sometimes, you know, the game is all about the result of all your preparation. And when you're just kind of going out to a game and you are prepared as a coach, like, I knew what was going on. I knew what the other team. But you don't have the time to actually practice, implement not only their game plan or what the other team does, but quite literally what you need to work on. Like, we. We didn't have an opportunity to enhance our offense through practice. So that was very frustrating.

You know, you look at five practices from December 21, and I would say some of those were, you know, long walkthroughs.

Yeah.

You know, where we had our whole team. Yeah.

You know, and I was at the Velpo game. What was that November game?

That was, right? November. Yeah, November.

And you could tell. I mean, you could tell you had the pieces young. Right. Like, you could see it, but you could see probably 10 minutes ago in the game, it was just like. It just wasn't there yet physically, because you hadn't had the time to everybody. For everybody to play together. Right. And for everybody just. And you could see, you know, even those practices where you had everybody, like you said, it's not like you get to know how guys are going to react in certain situations because you don't have the time to put them in certain situations. You don't see how they respond to that. So that had to. But yet you still went on the road and won some big games during the season.

Yeah, I mean, for us, we won the most road games in school history this year. That's an accomplishment that we're proud about. You know, I think what happened was, as the season continued to go on, you had to make choices of how you were going to react. I know I said it a little bit ago, but in our team, for the most part. For the most part, we reacted to just become closer. Because that was the one thing about the road that was actually unique, was when you're on the road, we could be around each other. We could be around each other, like in the hotel room, were on each other with each other. On the bus at home, were literally telling people, come to practice or shoot and then go home.

And then not only go home, but go to your own room and go isolate.

So, you know, that's really good to let college kids have the conversation in their head when they had a bad practice. Go isolate. That works well.

You go. Yeah, you're a little frustrated. Yeah, just go think about it yourself, and I'll see you tomorrow. Don't talk to anybody. If you want to make sure it's. You're not. You're not face to face with any teammates at all.

Yeah, there you go. And I'll be good for you.

It'll be awesome.

Yeah, that'll be good. So it had to be good to get out on the road.

It was. It was kind of, you know, it was one of those things where it was exhausting as the season went on. But there were definitely some advantages. We had the ability to. To interact more than. Than were at home, because actually, when we. When were finally kind of out of our isolation or quarantines or whatever the protocols called it at that time, that was when our season was really kind of revving up, and were traveling quite a bit and with each other on a daily basis.

So with all the chaos and all the distractions with COVID protocol, other sports, you know, just things going on, how was it you were able to continue to build the culture, keep teaching the things that you wanted to teach, keep the vibe going, keep the energy up, keep the faith. Right. And then yet still find time to recruit? Of course, you couldn't go on the road and recruit, but you still had to do that.

Yeah, you had to make an effort to put the student athlete first. You know, you're Making decisions based as really, it probably made me a better coach in the long term because I felt that whenever there was some struggle, you had to err on the side of. This is something no one's ever gone through before. Let's make sure that the student athlete, the guys on your team, this team is okay. We. Mentally, physically, emotionally. And that's kind of how I just started making choices. You know, you didn't want to waver on your culture because some guys cracked in certain areas. The relationships weren't always built over time, like I was saying earlier. So now you're in this chaotic situation where it's very difficult.

Well, you don't have a history together necessarily to rely upon, but you just had to go above and beyond and make sure that you put the. Put the. Every decision that was made was, how is this going to affect in a positive way the student athlete on your team? And then you tried figuring out how to be successful on the court. And that's where the. The struggle began.

Well, the court had to be sort of an escape from everything else, like the whole reality of what were going through in some sense, especially the games.

Yeah, it was. You know, it was. You felt there was a certain amount of, like, normalcy at times when you're on the court. The thing that we struggled with was within that something that was typically normal or felt that were all used to there. It was a very different environment. Right. You're spaced out. Certain guys have certain. Certain areas. Everyone had to go through it. So those are. Those aren't excuses. Those are just facts. But the thing that was the biggest struggle was the lack of preparation that was going into, like, you know, you go into a math test, maybe you and I have gone once or twice in our life unprepared. We didn't study.

We didn't know to carry the two or the remainder or whatever core math is now, you know, you go in there and it's very frustrating when you're not prepared for that test. And again, it. It sounds like an excuse at times, but the fact was there were times we played on a Monday afternoon and then played Tuesday afternoon. So you weren't prepared. So that became frustrating within the game because it's a competitive environment and that was a balance as well, to really figure that out.

Well, and here's what's cool. Like, when the whole Covid started and I had a bunch of really successful business owners, CEOs, and I said, my belief was this, that either you're going to grow through this adversity, or you're just going to go through it, you're going to come out the other side and your culture is either going to be revealed, there's going to be exposed. Exposed being negative. Right. Like you're paying lip service to it. But yours was absolutely revealed. Like your culture of find a way and fall famine. I want to talk about that because you guys played your best basketball at the end of the season, did you not?

Yeah, we did. We ended up winning seven conference games. I think most conference road wins, I think. I think it was seven. And we had a lot of.

That has to do with the work that you put into it during the grind, though, did it not?

It was. It was. We, you know, it was neat to see. We won some games we had to win. You know, to get into the end goal isn't always to make the conference tournament. Obviously you want to be at the top of that ladder and cut down a net, but you had to have some. Some goals that were attainable throughout this season for us. And. And our guys really came together and we're like, all right, that's something. You know, we want to get to the conference tournament. We want to get to Evansville in play. And our guys did. And it was something that was. It was exciting because you're like, okay, this is something that if we can stay together for the long term, it's. It's going to pay off.

So what are the conversations been like this off season? Because you ended on a high note even though you lose the last game. I mean, there's only one team that wins the last game of the season. But what are the conversations in terms of the story that your players are telling themselves, what you can accomplish now when you look back on all that you've been through?

Well, I think one of the obvious things is no one did anything. No, nobody did what we did last year. Like, there's not a team in the country that did what we did, you know, 19 games and 43 days. So you can build on that. Like, listen, we have been through something that no one. We are the resource. We are the source that somebody would have to, if it ever were to happen again. They'd be like, oh, that's the team who did it. So that was one thing that you build on, like, verbally, emotionally, and kind of, you know, one of our mantras this summer, we talked about know me and O M E. We wanted to have a know me summer because right now we've had so much isolation. Right? You're.

You're telling people to come here and then go stay by yourself or make sure you stay apart. And it's the rules of society right now to try to survive. So, you know, right now were able to build this summer on that no mentality because our guys understood that separation was. Was a struggle in itself. And they really bought into when we had the opportunity to get out on the court again in practice. Together, we parlayed last season's isolation into more of a team than I think that this team has ever had. I told the team at the beginning of the summer, this is going to be the most productive summer you have ever had, whether it's guys, transfers, other places, coming from other schools. And I think we achieved that. Now we still have a long way to go.

But the mentality was definitely, we are doing this together. Because when you don't do it together and you are isolated, it's not nearly as fun, and the struggle is tough.

And you do an amazing job of creating this family culture and this family atmosphere and environment. And a lot of that came from playing for your dad, working for your dad. That's the way it was. I mean, it wasn't. We talked about it, we just did it. Can you talk into that a little bit about how you do that? There's what you guys do together as a team, how you carry yourselves together as a team. Cause it really is pretty powerful.

It is. In last year, I'm not acting like I'm John Wood and I'm not Phil Jackson, but the one thing that I have within me is an ability to be part of some. A family atmosphere. And if we can build that, and that's, you know, that's a big belief in the culture, I think that's going to win us as many games as the practices. That's where you become special. And that's where I've been around great leaders. That's where we're best at. And the thing that we struggled with, obviously last year, you couldn't have that. You know, you had to have some zooms. You were trying to be creative and that kind of stuff. Well, we missed out on that. So now that is even more of a focus. And it goes back to the teams you were on.

I mean, I was 10, 11 years old. You talk about, why do you want to coach? Did you always know you wanted to coach because your dad was a coach? And I was like, I never didn't think about coaching. I never did. And the reason I probably was at that point in my life Is that you guys, Your teams at Creighton were that good golf shop. Right? We're not very good at golf, but when you hit that good drive, you're like, I'm going to keep doing this. That was fun. You guys were that golf shot for me. You guys were that thing that I will never forget. Never.

The Thanksgiving dinners, the tears, a parent passes away, and one of the players staying at the house for three or four days, the struggle, the excitement, all of that was something that I just was around. And it was because of the culture that, you know, obviously my dad, his staff, you being part of the. Both the staff and as a player was so important part of my life that. And I love it and I want to. I want to give that to my kids. I want to give it to the team that I'm around. So you just got to work at it, which.

And were a tight family. And I need to take a side step here for a second. I won't tell the whole story, so we don't have the time. We were such a tight family that your mom and dad felt that it was okay for us to stay at the pool with you in Monte Carlo, and they entrusted us to babysit you. But the rest of the story will leave alone you guys.

Yeah.

I'm sure you. We didn't do the best job, but we're good. Life lessons, Brian. Life lessons. Yeah. No, but it's so fun to watch, you know, and obviously I see so much of your dad and you. Right? I see so much of your dad and you and the way you do things and to see your kids. When I watch the videos of you guys, whether you're swimming, Whether it's your 4th of July party, we're having water balloon fights. And I see your little guy in there, and hopefully they don't torture him the way we tried torture you.

They do.

Yeah. Good, good. But it's part of being a coach's son. Right. I mean, that's why. But it's just. It's really cool to see. And thing is, you don't really know when that's going to pay off, but you know, that family culture is going to pay off at times. Can you talk into. Talk about find a way came from what it means? Because on the surface it's like, okay, we just find a way to figure it out. No, that's not what it means at all. I mean, there's. There's so much to it. When you peel away at the layers.

It is. I've been asked That a lot. And you know where it came from. I mean, I remember at Texas A and M, you know, one of my teams that my dad, he always used to put the shorts, the defense, or one year he had V for Jim Valvano, who had passed away, a friend of his on all the gear. And so one of the years was find a way. And you know, at the beginning of the season, the coaches had pretty kind of a mantra what it meant. And you know, it was something that I think, you know, it was your.

Freshman year, I think.

Yeah, it was my. Yeah, freshman year. Freshman year for sure, freshman year. So, you know, I'm 18, 17, 18 years old and I don't know how much I, I don't want to say bought in or understood it or felt it, but when I was probably, you know, 35, 36 years old, whatever the case may be, it really hit me where this mentality of finding a way is something that just gets stuff accomplished. It's about being self aware, it's about being self reliant, it's about not having excuses and getting the job done. If you want to put it into basketball terms, it's kind of the end all, be all answer. You can say, okay, this guy drives right 90% of the time. Well, if he goes left and scores, you got to find a way to still stop him.

You still have to understand that the rules of our rotations defensively, they're in place for the percentages. But at the end of the day, you still gotta find a way to get to make a play. You just simply have to figure it out. At times I think it puts onus on the person, I think it allows you to kind of look at yourself first. And I think awareness, especially now, it's a great way to really look at how you're approaching anything instead of just asking. I have four kids that they're quick to just say Mom. The names, mom and dad are the best names in the world. But there's some days where those are some. I wish my name wasn't dead sometimes because they were using that at a high level.

They're not always looking to figure things out and other kids, but so when you're older, that mentality is something that I don't know if I can ever totally explain it, how deep it is to me, it literally put me in a position to be a head coach one day. It's almost like I want to thank that mentality, which just sounds crazy and then you have to. But when you sit there and really look at it. I talked about a lot of individualistic traits. Like, you still got to figure it out. You still, I got to do this, I got to do that. Well, when you really look at it, yeah, it does have to start with you. But if you don't add that family aspect of it, the fam, the fall fam, find a way family.

If you don't add that family aspect of it, I don't know if you're ever going totally achieve your greatness that you can be part of. Because two things. It's always better to do things with a group of people that you love. Right. I mean, it's not as fun to go cut down a net after a championship and looking down. And then you're also putting the scissors away, cutting all the rings of the net and putting the ladder away. You want to get down and hug people and celebrate. So you want to do it together. And then the other thing is, you can't always do it alone. Why not rely on people that are in your support system that you have chosen to be around you?

If you've made the choice to have people around you in your life, why would you not utilize their best assets to get your best asset amplified or your goals achieved? So I want our guys to understand, hey, yeah, I want you to figure things out. I want you to be self reliant. But we're here for you. And sometimes being here for you is simply saying, no, you got to do this one on your own, buddy. But there's other times where it's like, no, I need to give you a hug. I need to put my arm around you. And I learned just as much from them as they do for me with that atmosphere. So the Findaway mentality has really expanded into the Findaway family.

How awesome is it to have that conversation? What you just had to say those words when you're recruiting and you explain it to the recruit, you explain it to his parents. Obviously we're in a whole different world right now with recruiting. We're not going to get into that and everything that's going on. But still it all comes back to that, right? The singleness of purpose and being a part of something bigger than yourself and those families, knowing that you're pulling their son into another family culture, how significant is that?

I think it's important. It's important because it's genuine. And I, you know, I have a lot of analogies in my life, but like, you know, back to The Future is one of the best movies ever. I love that. I wish we can get in that DeLorean and I could fly to the top of that ladder with my team when I'm cutting down a net at Green Bay. Or I wish I could take him back to the Civic Auditorium or actually Drake, when. When the championship was at Creighton.

Wichita.

Wichita. And I'm punching the shocker with Jeff Thick. And that's a whole nother story. I wish I could take that time machine to show these guys that.

Yeah.

Because I think if they can experience that feeling, then there's no doubt that every day you're going to bring it. Well, we can't. So you have to really express a genuineness about what you're trying. Why that Find a way family. Why that mentality? Why? I want to experience again so much that feeling. And I want to do it with a group of guys that you believe in and grow with. And it's not always like, I mean, obviously there's times where you're at each other's, you know.

Absolutely. Yep.

You know, but that's part of the family.

How do you get that emotional attachment to a vision, to a goal, to a dream. Right. Like you just talked about. We wish we'd get into DeLorean and experience that. It goes back to like Valvano cutting down the net at the beginning of the season. Right. His first practice and things like that. And as coaches, you love to talk about it, but how do you really with your team now, do you sit and explain to them the reality of the life changing experiences when you're competing for championships?

Thank you. Constantly. You got to be consistent with it. You know, you have to have the subtle things. Like we have a pair of scissors above a door that I don't know if our guys even know yet. It's like an emergency break when ready, when needed. Because we're gonna go get those scissors and I'm gonna cut down a net. So you have the subtleties. You have, you know, the things on the shirts that might have a meaning and things like that. And then you also put it right in front of their face. You put, you know, guys you've coached or people that have had success, whether it's, you know, you bring them in front of, you know, a group of guys that starting a business or I was part of this team and this is what sparked this aspect of my life.

And I think it's just a constant. You show the examples. You gotta balance it where it's not just my Examples. Coach Crean was great to me, and he still is.

He.

I wanted to beat Michigan State more than anyone in the country at one point when were at Marquette, because he was always explaining, and I appreciate it now, but they would, you know, they were in the Final Four. They were a special team at Michigan State. Obviously, it's still a special culture. You know, he would always just talk about, you know, the successes there. And as a player, sometimes you don't always want to accept that for some reason, you know, whether we're just 18, 19 years old, being immature. So as a coach, I've always thought of that. You got to show those experiences from personal experiences, but you also want to show some other things to kind of change it up a little bit.

And if I can connect, you know, one guy at a time to really start that belief, you know, you have a guy who runs a business locally and another guy who starts on an NBA championship or finals team. If they can connect in their own way, then great.

Now, speaking of connecting and stories and stuff like that, I don't know if it's just because we talk a lot or it's because I know so much about your journey in this team and this program, but you have some unbelievable individual stories on that team with the players. Like, their stories are mind blowing.

Okay, yeah.

And you do it. But you do, I mean, you do a great job of honoring those stories and where they've come from and what's impacted their life and the circumstances that they've evolved from and responded to. But how important? Because I think in the corporate world, I think where people miss the boat, you know, they know that people want to be valued. Right. They want to know the work they do is important. They want to be coached. But I think part of that being the high impact coach like yourself, is knowing what makes your people tick. And to know what makes your people tick, you have to know their stories. How big is that for you? Like, how intentional are you about really getting to know your kids stories at a deep level?

You have to. I mean, I'm very intentional because there's that moment on the court where I'm asking you to do something or maybe telling you to do something that is going above and beyond what you mentally or physically think you're capable of doing. And maybe sometimes it's in a confrontational way, but if they understand that if I were to take a step off that court and they were to take a step off that court and ask me for something, or I was going to Ask them, this isn't that one way street. This is a together thing. And if I were to ask them or if they were to ask me something, they understand that there's a relationship there. And there's more to me just saying, hey, set a harder screen, Go rebound better. So I think you have to be intentional about it.

I think you have to take the time to go, how's your sister doing all right? Is your mom doing okay? I think you have to understand, like, you know, where are you? I understand that, like, you know, you're far from home and you're in college and we all think it's great and you're excited, but man, this guy is away from home for the first time, you know, ever. You know, you have to make that effort and be very intentional with it because then you really, you start viewing these guys too, as they're giving me a lot on a daily, on a day to day basis, physically. They really are. I mean, you're asking a lot from them. I better darn sure, you know, fight for them off the court if I'm going to fight for them on the court.

Well, and then how do you do that? So you have all these individual stories, all these people with these individual journeys and then make them a cohesive team, right? And to make sure that they're. I mean, we all want to win, and part of winning is earning our playing time. And part of winning for some folks is getting their stats. But how do you make sure that each one is A, maximizing their ability each and every day, right? Doing the best they can with what they have, and B, just becoming an MVP of the role, like sacrificing for the greater good of the team, yet still like, okay, pursue your dream, you know, work your lips off and just be a part of something bigger than yourself.

Well, I mean, you talk about the role like we have something that's one of, you know, your role, embrace your role, be a star in your role. It's real simple. Know your role, embrace your role and be a star in your role. So whatever your role is, all right, you can be a star in that role. You can literally be the best person on the team at that position in that role. So we talk about that a lot. I think you ask them questions about themselves personally. You put them in a position where. And then you listen, you know, you don't just say it like, all right, I asked him how he was doing today, but I was also over there thinking of the next thing I was about to do, you listen.

And it's fun because sometimes you hit somebody, even if it's academically, like, hey, how'd your English tests go today? And they kind of give you a double take in the middle of practice. Like, you want good coach? You know, geez. Like, I think you have to be intentional with that kind of stuff. But then you also have them share that within. Within the team setting. There you can do it randomly asking questions in front of the team, or there are times where we'll. We'll put a guy in front of the locker room, and we have 10 questions. We ask him 10 questions. You know your biggest accomplishment, one of your fears, something that is silly that, you know, no one knows about. How many people are in your family? What are your. What are your sisters and brothers? Names?

You know, the things that we think we know about everybody that we're around every single day. But then next thing you know, some of the guys are going, I didn't realize that you had an older sister that you lived with or something like that. She helped raise you. And putting those guys in settings like that where they're able to communicate with each other, because I don't think they ever. You're 18, 19, 20 years old. You don't sit there and talk about all the time that you have these deep thoughts. We have a young man on our team that had a brain tumor five, six years ago. Couldn't walk and talk. He went in the middle of the night and thought he had a headache. And next thing you know, he's going into brain surgery.

And next thing you know, he asked himself, this is a question he said, he asked himself, if I close my eyes and I don't wake back up, have I done enough? Am I ready? I mean, are you kidding me? Like, I mean, he says that to me. I see it on, like, a. I saw it on a video that he put together. And he says that to the team. None of us have asked that. Right.

Well. And then isn't that where you move from being in the fight with each other to being in the fight for each other? Right? That whole different kind, that whole mind, different mindset, and you refuse to let each other fail because of how tight you are. And you just made a great point by asking those questions. Because, I mean, when were 18 or 19, we found out things about each other when life pulled those things out, when certain people. When a teammate went through a mom being sick or mom and dad getting separated or losing a sibling or something like that, I mean, that's when we found out about each other. But you think about how powerful it is to sit there and pull those questions out of each other. Then they had the guys be honest with each other.

I don't know what I would have said if someone asked me my biggest fears when I was 18. I'm figuring out my major. I don't know.

Well, I think one of our biggest fears was the same human being that I grew up with and the guy that were and the person he was married too, I think even more so, I think were scared if she was going to handle us, if we made her.

But that was a fear out of respect.

That was. That was a different level.

Admiration and respect is what they have.

Heard that, no doubt.

No, but it's. That's awesome. And you had to have seen that show up in games and practices when guys were going through stuff during this whole kind of crazy time.

You did. No, you 100% did. Because when it didn't show up, it was even more evident. And that's when I thought that, like, when someone acted in a particular way that. That, you know, you don't agree with or you wish they had not, it was glaring because it was a little more uncommon than. Than. And that's where you know you're going in the right direction because it's. Those things stood out. And then the intentional questions or the intentional pats on the back or the sacrifices that these guys were making. I mean, they were playing every day to exhaustion. At one time, we had a kid that was in high school in December, 33 days later, after one practice, he's playing at Belmont, like on our team.

So that sacrifice, a willingness to just go out there and say, you know what, guys, I'm going to. I don't know what I'm doing, and it's going to be pretty hard, but I'm going to try. For you.

How much does that help your players? They police the culture themselves, right? Because they're protecting it like it's the culture worth fighting for. And knowing those things about each other and going through those things and growing through those things with each other. How much has that helped your players police the culture?

I think it's moved us in the right direction for sure. There's no doubt about that. We have guys that are willing to. To say, we're not doing that. No, no. We're not having a year that is in chaos.

Not.

Not because of what they necessarily did, but just because of the situation. But we're not where we ultimately want to be. I think you always are going to strive for it, but we're moving in the right direction. You can definitely see to these guys credit, these young men's credit. They embraced the practice. For lack of a better term, they've embraced. Okay, we've had 6am Boot camp. Don't totally want to do it, but you know what? It. It's worth it because I'm not going through what went through, and went through too much to not go through this as well.

Yeah. Now you talk about the 6am Boot camp and all that stuff, and now you bring recruits on campus. Okay, will your players be your best recruiters? And when they are your best recruiters, they have the ability to. And I believe I know the answer to this question, but I want you to talk about it to our listener. Do they have the ability to say, coach, listen, they're a great fit, or coach, they might be a great talent, but there's no way they're going to make this team better. Like, they're. They're bad. Like, it's just not. There's not a fit right there.

No, that's a great question, because I don't think people get that concept like you. You bring these. These guys to campus and you. You want them to hang out with your team. You want to see if they're going to fit in. A good player might not be a good player in one program that he is for another program, just because it's right. We're all different people in different cultures, and we all do it a little bit differently. So the way that we do it is starting to really be evident within our own team. So when guys do come to campus, I am one to always ask, do you think they'll fit? I don't always say, how good do you think he is? Because sometimes they play on their own or they kind of know each other. We're supposed to do that.

You know, you'll ask at times like, hey, do you ever play against him? Or things like that? But what I want to know is, like, do you respect that guy? You know, if you play against him, What I want to know is he. Is he a guy that, like, on the bus we can have some fun with? Or if we're doing karaoke in the. In the whole hotel one day, is he going to jump up and we'll have a good time with like, they're our best recruiter. They are. Because if I'm going to sit there and talk about the family, find a way, family mentality, in togetherness. I have to be able to show them. This is what I mean. I have evidence. Here's my team. Here's what I'm talking about. Here are the guys that I feel that you are like.

You might not be exactly like, but you can be part of. So I'm definitely. They're a huge part of our recruiting, for sure. For sure.

And as we begin to wind down here, I want to make sure I don't miss something that's very significant because we talk about change a lot, and I really felt like my coaching career prepared me for the business career, because every single day, there's something happening. Like, there's so much that's out of our control in the coaching world, right? Things that are happening that you have no idea. But now there's this change that's right in your face. There's a name, image and all that. And then there's the transfer portal. And I think the transfer portal is huge. And for you, building a program with good people, right, not trying to. You don't want the quick fix, but you also don't want to miss out on. Players can help get you to the next level.

How important is it for you and your staff to constantly be on top of how you're embracing change and how you're. How you're working through it?

Well, you got to educate yourself. You got to know it. You know, you got to know it before you just decide whether you're going to be part of going this direction in recruiting or taking part of this. And name, image and likeness. So you got to educate yourself to understand the rules and the new trends. You know, ask other coaches, ask other places. And then you have to decide what we decided. For this most recent recruiting class, which is kind of the first one after the transfer portal, we really kind of stayed true to what I would have done a year or two ago. I was a transfer. Now I was a transfer because you guys shouldn't have signed me. I was averaging two points a game, and Tyron Liu was. Was having a bucket or two on me.

So I unfortunately, did not salvage.

It was the first shot he made the whole game.

Yeah, I was. I came out there, hit a bucket on him to start the game. I was like, let's go. And then by the end of the game, we finished with 30 between the two of us, and I still had my two.

That's all right. It's still 30 between it. It's 30 between the two point.

We had 30 between the two of us, but like, you know, don't forget.

You also played 300 minutes at Oklahoma too, and never came off the floor.

Yeah, that was a good. That was just one layup. We just needed one layup. Just needed one layup to win that game.

Let it go.

That's it.

I don't want to say track.

That's a beast.

Big time. We'll talk about that next week.

Yeah, because I was a transfer. So my point is that like I, you know, I. We all transfer or don't transfer for different reasons. There's so many reasons why that portal is being filled good and bad. And I think it just keeps on coming down to what do you need? Position wise, where's the relationship from? Is it something that you have built? Just you and your staff have gotten identified a player and really gotten to know him?

Is it.

Are you calling the different coaches that they've played for and trusting those relationships? Because some coaches are going to be like, oh yeah, he's a great kid and they just want him off your hands. Other coaches are going to be, yeah, he's a great kid and I wish I would have worked out. And it's a little bit more substance to it. So you got to be able to kind of be a little bit of a detective as well.

And when you say that, what do you mean by that? You have to be sort of a little bit detective as well.

I mean, you have to take the time to ask the questions because I always tell our team, or I'm sorry, recruits and families when they're in here, I'm going to protect the locker room. I always want to protect the locker room. Because if your son's in that locker room, if I don't protect it with you through this process, if I don't show you that I'm protecting the locker room through this process, as a young man potentially being on my team, then who's going to say that the next guy, if you happen to be in my locker room, that I'm. That I'm just not saying stuff. I'm not protecting the locker room when your son is in my locker room. So you have to ask the questions. You have to do your research from a basketball side too.

Is he scoring points that are going to be the type of points that he can score for our culture, for our offense? Is he the kind of player that, you know is successful within our scheme and our system? So it's not always like you're trying to find out bad, you're just trying to Find out information to best put your team and that young man in a position to succeed.

Right? Right. And I always, you know, I remember as a coach, I always want to know. Of course, we always want to know if people can win together. Right? Can I win with this kid? You know, can we win with this person? I want to know if we can. If we could lose with you. In other words, can we go through things. Can we go through things and learn through the failure and sustain our effort and not have a poisonous culture? Right. And not. Not have the siloing or the backstabbing or. Or can we still embrace the opportunity and the challenges? Now, I want to say something to you, okay? And I want you to tell me, and I've never done this before, the podcast.

So you can sit there and joke about being episode 132, or you can embrace the fact that you are the first person ever to do this. It is.

You're going to like.

You're going to like it. You'll love it. I'm going to say something. I want you to tell me what it means to you, what it would mean to your program and to the kids inside the program. Leave your jersey in a better place.

Leave your jersey. And if I were to say that to them?

Well, if I say it to you, what would that mean? Like, leave your jersey in a better place. So if you tell your players, leave your jersey, or if you focus on leaving your jersey in a better place for those that are going to come.

After you, that's great. Well, I think you can. You can take it to a whole nother level. I'm a believer to have the name on the back of the jersey. I don't think the name on the back of your jersey represents, like, Barone. On the back of my jersey didn't represent Brian Barone. It represented all the Bronies that I'm part of. It represented my family. So I don't think it's a very individualized. I love that thing, I think, you know, and then obviously the name on the front of the jersey as well. So if you were going to say that to me, you know, did you come in here and represent your family?

Did you represent for my team, the siue athletic family, in a way that puts the next person who happens to put on not the actual jersey, but your number within that team, are they in a better place from a standpoint of really everything? Are you having an opportunity to come in and hear win a little bit better than when you put it on? Are you able to Wear that with a little bit more pride than when you put it on, because you always want to have pride in it. But then you win, and then. But then you act right, and then I get to put that jersey on, and then I get to fill that. And so. So if you were going to ask me what that means, it just. I think it means that.

Did you come in here and represent every letter, every aspect on that jersey, on the back of that jersey in a way that would make the people that you respect, care about, and fight for you proud?

I love that. You know, one of the things that's really cool about our high school program here that Coach Nazos does is he has on the one. I mean, there's a rich basketball tradition here in Batavia. Craig Sager being from here, but some great players have come through here over the years. And on the wall, there's every number. Okay. Jersey, every number. And it's every player going back to. I think it's 1967. Every player that's worn that number. Yeah, it is. And it's funny because when we guys come back for a Thanksgiving tournament, it's like one of the first thing alums go back and look at, and, you know, there's times that they think it's really cool that someone wore their number, and there's times they're like, I can't believe that fool wore my number. Right. And I see. I think there's so much.

And if you get the kids to focus on that, like, you know, this locker, this jersey, this number is going to set the bar a little bit higher. Yeah, I think that's what you folks are doing at siu, and I just love watching it.

Well, no, I appreciate it. I really do. It's a lot of work. I'm answering all these questions like, I have all the answers. I mean, you know, there's a lot of times where you just kind of sitting there like, all right, I gotta. I gotta find a way to get through this situation and figure it out. So, like, everything that I kind of regurgitate or say is through experiences, but experiences of the leaders, with the leaders before me. My dad used to always say, there's one guy who invented basketball. Everyone else is just stealing.

Right?

That's what we're doing. And you always want to draw upon. I love what you're doing. I love how you're. You're covering and relating so many different aspects of athletics and business to ultimately the success. You know, we all want to have a certain amount of success that allows the people that you care about to have success. Therefore, after you. And I think that if you take your approach, that you are trying to have success for the next guy in that jersey, the next guy in that locker room, because you have such great pride in what this university or your team is giving you, then you're doing a heck of a job.

I love that. Brian, I can't thank you enough. Now, we're going to do an encore interview at the end of the season, and when we do, I want you sitting in the same seat. I love the find a way sign you showed me, and I hope and I expect that'll be hanging on the wall.

You know what?

The next time we talk.

I just was changing it for the interview. You got the sun coming in now. It was almost like.

But I know that's a great sign you show. I mean, I know. Let's just make sure that's hanging in the background.

It's part of our brand. It's part of our brand. And that'll make someone happy by. By putting in the right prominent spot on this.

All right. Thanks, man. I appreciate you. I appreciate how you're doing things.

You're the best. You're the best.

You are. Thanks, Brian.

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